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July 11th, 2007

Avoiding Automatic Defensive Postures

Automatic Defensive PostureMost women, have well-developed automatic defensive postures for use when men ‘come on’ to them. Many women assume an automatic defensive posture (ADP) around specific men or even certain types of men. Others go into ADP around men in general under a blanket ‘presumption of guilt’. ADP will in any case frequently be triggered if you show indications of sexual interest or attention that a woman does not specifically ask for.

Triggering the automatic defensive posture (ADP) much of the time eliminates your chances of positive interactions at all, never mind getting laid! These defensive postures involve a great deal of resistance to any interactions with you, and even hostility towards you, based on the assumption (which may or may not, be true) that you ‘just want to get into her pants’. The trouble is that everything you do from this point on is viewed in a certain light. Even if your attention was actually just curiosity, being sociable, or desire to ‘get to know her’, you looked like an invader so she has pulled up the drawbridge and the castle is in defensive posture. You can try to storm the castle, but that can be painful; far better to come back when the queen does not feel threatened and has lowered the drawbridge. On a different day she may even invite you in for tea.

Recognizing ADP:
Train yourself to sense when a woman has gone into ADP mode. If your instincts are really that bad, and sensitivity and intuition are not your strong points, if you cannot tell by the inflection in her voice, then at least associate it specifically with some of these signs.

Eye contact, above all things, eye contact. A woman may cross her arms or legs to hold off your sexual overtures, but if she still looks in your eyes she is still interested in you. Early detection of ADP can also help you avoid much suffering. Avoid pushing social interactions with these women unless you have a high tolerance for pain, or the technical skills for disarming ADP.

Avoiding ADP:
To avoid triggering a woman’s ADP come in from a different perspective. The key is to give women the perception that you are not ‘hitting on them’. This means literally changing the reason why you are talking to her. If you are a good actor you may be able to fake it for a while, but the best way I know to do that is at first, simply not to hit on her sexually, at all.

In terms of introduction:

In terms of initial psychology:

Luckily for you, most women have a well-developed sense of ’social and community bonding’. Approaching women from this standpoint or in this context will significantly enhance your interactions. In this circumstance, women very easily cycle into an automatic ’social’ posture that is quite the opposite of ADP. In this posture, not only are women more open to interactions with men (i.e. you), but this role even causes them to be pro-actively social. In this posture you can interact without having to be perceived as chasing them or pushing for sex. In fact, if you are skilful enough, it will even allow you to reverse the normal psychology and have her ‘chase’ you for more interaction. The key is to avoid interactions that allow her to cycle back into the ‘classical’ psychological posture that men immediately want sex and women have to play ‘hard to get’ for long enough to ensure that they have earned it. This is ADP.

In fact, as part of the propensity for ’social bonding’ the typical female psyche involves a desire to be seen as ‘nice’ or ‘good’. This is a typical female ‘blind spot’, although it has been getting less common over time (Who knew that emancipation also meant: ‘the right to be bitchy’). In fact, if you find the right woman you can actually use a seduction technique referred to as the “nice trap”.

Posted by Scott in Psychology, Sociology

This entry was posted on Wednesday, July 11th, 2007 at 9:36 pm and is filed under Psychology, Sociology. You can follow any responses to this entry through the comments RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

4 Responses to “Avoiding Automatic Defensive Postures”

  1. JSterling says:

    If it’s clear that you’re after sex, or deeply and overtly interested in a woman, you are likely to trigger ADP, unless she is interested in you as well. If, on the other hand, one approaches a woman of potential interest too much like a buddy, you run the risk of sending the wrong signal. That is, I don’t believe it is a successful strategy to present yourself as a friend and later reveal your romantic interest. It is better to reveal your ‘potential’ romantic interest early and face rejection than to hide one’s intent.

  2. Oliver says:

    Roger’s input in the first scene of the film Roger Dodger (amongst your recommended media) is a perfect example of what I would hope to achieve when dealing with ADP. Without me obviously steering her to do so, I would trigger a girl to imagine sex or even introduce it into our conversation by herself.

    In the film Roger’s argument is flawed because it omitted sex, the omission begs to be corrected, but is perceived as an oversight, rather than being orchestrated.

    Alternatively, NLP techniques may also be of help, make her associate you with sex under her radar.

    Either way, escalation should subsequently feel more congruent with the circumstances and her new feelings towards you. If she feels in control of any sexual or at least suggestive conversation, she will be far more at ease and you’re less likely to trip yourself up.

    I think JSterling raises a good point: relationships polarise. From his comment it strikes me that either one of a number of things is going on inside her head.

    ADP may be caused by “assumption of guilt”, so the woman never looses sight of a man’s sexuality. Scott’s avoidance tactics eventually qualify him because he’s the only man who has proven to have strict morals… and then the priest disrobes the nun!

    However, this assumption might exclude a happy middle (where Scott would fall.) This would polarise all men into either buddy material, or sexual predators to be avoided. This is a very devout nun. No one (Jonathan excepted) seduces her!

    Lastly, there may be a girl who takes this posture merely because of social conditioning. She isn’t thrilled by “good men”, let alone wants celibacy. In effect she is just calling your bluff - giving you a “shit test”. JSterling would teasingly mock her posturing and she would promptly disarm… and after some interesting romance, disrobe!

    Of course it is tempting to bite the bullet rather than waste energy on someone who may eventually reject your advances. But I believe you’ve got to make a quick judgement as to which of these kind of girls stand before you, ask whether you are willing to make sacrifices, and then act accordingly.

  3. Jonathan says:

    @Oliver, there’s a number of points here that I feel need elaboration.

    I hope I made it as obvious as possible in the Introduction and Rationale pages that contrary to the beliefs of several people I’ve met, there is no one ‘correct’ answer as to how to seduce; because people are not objects to be conquered. In the film, Roger doesn’t understand this, and so at first, during the initial banter he comes across as confident and charismatic, but he’s also cold, calculating, aloof around people and unable to make any kind of emotional connection.

    Then, because he’s portrayed as working in advertising, his seduction strategy is very similar. i.e. to show people problems, and then to present himself as the solution (much the same way most stuff is advertised on TeeVee these days). We see him do this a number of times after his break-up with Joyce, to the point that he pulls of an almost exact character assessment, and then blows everything up, perhaps because he’s not thinking straight after the break-up, or he’s just so good that he needs to handicap himself.

    Anyway, I suspect the situation you are describing is more ‘When Harry Met Sally’ than ‘Roger Dodger’. In the opening scene to the film, Roger is not enacting a seductive role because we find out later in the film that he has already slept with Joyce, but has become sloppy in his relationship with her. And thus, she dumps him for another co-worker.

    If anything, I’d suggest that his psychobabble is more reminiscent of the Seduction Idols that will promise you ‘get any girl’, if only you’ll give them $$$$. We’re told later that “[Roger] writes good copy” and “[Roger could] talk himself out of anything”. Interestingly a later scene bears this out, when Nick says “You said you score every night” and Roger responds “I say a lot of things” and then obfuscates by telling Nick to call his mother. Similar dubious hyped up theories can be found in the real world, if you search certain message boards for the phrase “50,000 years ago”.

    Anyway, I Suspect Scott is discussing an optimization strategy, whilst JSterling points to attitude and you seem to be taking a more psychological stance. All are equally excellent points, and I’m sure all will work well, only some may work better in different circumstances. Thus, by having more choices, we all gain extra equipment for the seduction toolbox.

    Finally, I’ve often wondered why guys want to go out and get contacts of as many women as possible. It strikes me that by picking the right person initially, having a good attitude and a number of different skills to choose from, depending upon the circumstances and environment etc. One can meet quality women sooner, and then enjoy spending time with them instead of randomly trotting out tired old pickup lines to anyone that will listen, and harvesting a bunch of BOBFOC numbers you’ll probably never call anyway.

  4. Scott says:

    I’d like to hear more about how you would trigger a girl to imagine sex or even introduce it into a conversation.

    Unless it’s old information using corny lines about “Cock-tails”, “feeling a big hap-Penis inside” or “Newd-Irections.”

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